Yoshi's Island Mafia 2 : Revenge of the Koopas (Endgame)

[kinetic563]

I might be missing something but what exactly proves TSL is innocent?

Did we really try recruiting eachother and it failed because we're both either the Mason and/or Cultist? While it certainly is very plausible, one does wonder if it failed because TSL is Mafia. It could also be TSL was a regular neutral and another person whom may be Mason/Cultist got him before the other could. That is still a likely possibility. This is certainly something to think about.

Dunno what else has been going on in the scenes but you two always seem very confident that you're on the good side.

This is just something that's bugged me and I want some more info on that.(which would be difficult without role-claiming)

 

[Slacker]

Literally so much happened in the past two days, you guys have the worst timing haha

I might be missing something but what exactly proves TSL is innocent?

Did we really try recruiting eachother and it failed because we're both either the Mason and/or Cultist? While it certainly is very plausible, one does wonder if it failed because TSL is Mafia. It could also be TSL was a regular neutral and another person whom may be Mason/Cultist got him before the other could. That is still a likely possibility. This is certainly something to think about.

Dunno what else has been going on in the scenes but you two always seem very confident that you're on the good side.

This is just something that's bugged me and I want some more info on that.(which would be difficult without role-claiming)

I was going to give a cold read to start things off but I think this is more important. I want to remind to everyone to stay suspicious no matter what happens. For example, it's easy to look past certain people if there's an argument in the form of "HJ vs. Unknown" and "Billy vs. Koshi" where it seems as though one of the people being analyzed at the time has to be guilty. For all we know, either one could be innocent and mafia is just drawing attention to certain matters.

Because of the comment from Unknown above, I will retract my vote. I don't think an fos is warranted even, I was satisfied with the explanation.

Bear with me here considering I just had to read six pages of thread; after taking all of it in, my cold read is that Billy and Sashe are mafia. I really don't have any evidence as to why they would be mafia, but I figure posting my initial opinion could be useful later on. I'm going to read through a few things now and get my analysis on:

-First of all HJ, the expression you're looking for is omgus lol not to get off topic but yeah.

-On the whole Koshi matter, I feel as though his actions are due to inexperience in mafia. There was one instance where he said he was waiting in the shadows but really he was on a school trip or something along those lines. To me, there is a major difference in that backpeddling versus someone trying to cover up a real slip-up or mistake. While it is entirely valid to look at Koshi and see his actions as suspicious (because.. well.. his posts are full of holes and uncertainties), I think it's more interesting to look at it from the perspective that Koshi is possibly innocent. If we assume this, we would see that Koshi has incriminated himself because people have been jumping on him. Obviously people accusing other people is normal in mafia but Billy came on a bit more aggressive than I expected--probably why my first instinct was to suspect him though I don't feel that's strong enough to fos him.

-As for roles, it's hard to assign people roles and use that as evidence to clear them of innocence. On that matter, I highly doubt that HJ and Unknown are both recruiting roles--too little evidence and too little knowledge on roles to assume that.

-Also figured out why I suspected Sashe. If you look throughout the entire game, he exhibits a characteristic that always makes me think of mafia. The majority of his posts are simply reaffirming statements where he repeats something that has already been said OR says a statement without purpose (ie. "It may just be coincidence." "I see your point of view and respect that." "I agree with so and so." ect). This has happened often enough in games I've played (and resulted in a guilty verdict) to the point where I naturally pick it out. On the flipside, it may be due to not knowing what to say in conversation but I'm going to give in to this hunch. Here's one I found real quick.

If I am suspicious about anyone right now it is Unknown. You seem to be avoiding a lot of questions.

Indeed. Unknown always seems to be avoiding questions when someone suspects him. That's why I'll Vote: Unknown.

Fos sashe
Fos koshi

Sorry for making you guys wait, I probably forgot things so ask away.

 

[Slacker]

ebwop have fun reading that wall of text

Forgot to ask:
Koshi and Sashe how many games of mafia have you both played? If you have experience, was it only on this forum?

 

[yoshi1999]

I've played 1 before, on this forum..so I'm still a noob

 

[Slacker]

Koshi what is your reaction to my post? Do you feel as though people are ganging up on you or do you just have a lot on your plate?

 

[yoshi1999]

Koshi what is your reaction to my post? Do you feel as though people are ganging up on you or do you just have a lot on your plate?

Ya I feel as though people are ganging up, but that's expected, it's a mafia game and I should of been expecting it. But it's not totally ganging up, some is my fault, like not being able to give a straight answer even though I should have..I was just nervous when everyone started jumping! I really agree with what you said

 

[Billy12510]

To the shock and awe of no one I disagree with your accusation of me Slacker. I know me to be an innocent Shy Guy. I may as well throw that out there, I don't see me living through the night. Oh well, I don't regret anything.

 

[H-J Kaabii]

I suppose the point of viewing Koshi as an innocent and then comparing how he has reacted compared with people like Sashe does seem to suggest Koshi's means of defending himself were just because there wasn't really nothing else he could do. Not to mention Koshi hasn't really given demonstrated much in the way of scum tells that Slacker's been bringing up.

Things are getting interesting here. ... think one of them [Billy or Koshi] is a Yoshi. The problem is, I don't know who and I don't want to accidentally kill an innocent Townie. That's why I won't vote anyone right now but I'll be carefully watching Koshi and Billy.

(My ellipsis and square brackets) again the reaffirmation at the beginning. If we go about Slacker's current line of thinking, the above statement unintentionally may have narrowed down our suspect list to these three.

Note how Yoshidude has also focused the same suspicion on Koshi and Billy as well.

Probably the biggest thing I'd like to hear from Slacker is whether he considers my soft claim (this is important guys, I didn't do a full role claim, so Unknown's point about whether I could be mafia or vanilla just faking a role claim is quite valid and should be thought about) be sufficient enough to assume I am of a certain allegiance or not. In fact maybe it's worth asking everyone about how reliable do you think my soft claim is?

Looking back at Billy, he seemed quite clear to confirm both me and Unknown as town even though there is still a warranted degree of suspicion on both of us (Unknown moreso thanks to comments at the beginning). Granted, I did say that I was confident in Billy's alignment or something to that effect, but maybe I'm not so sure now.

I also just noticed that Billy never responded to my asking him if he wanted to role claim if he felt it was okay to clarify who he was. Maybe it's an oversight but it's still something I believe shouldn't have been overlooked at the time. Oh wait he role claimed already - do you mean a Vanilla Shy Guy?

FoS on Unknown very low, FoS on Koshi a little weaker than before otherwise pretty unchanged

And Slacker lol it's not the biggest of posts thanks for reminding me of omgus

 

[H-J Kaabii]

Ebwop

Sashe and Yoshidude, who out of Billy and Koshi do you suspect more based on all the posts of the day phase?

 

[Billy12510]

Yeah Slacker, remember the Mafia games you hosted here? Those were some good times...

Regular Vanilla Shy Guy.

But guys, we're forgetting the most important thing that's happened during this conversation, Cook had the decency to stop by and say hi, and you all ignored him. How could you?

 

[kinetic563]

Throughout this entire mess I've always been undecided on your alignment, TSL. Ever since the beginning.

If we go back, a Yoshi preventing a recruitment just seems too low especially considering only 1 night has passed. It would've definitely been by coincidence(as TSL said himself).

That first comment from TSL has always stuck out to me. And you guys should consider that.

Given what info we received, I'm retracting my vote on Koshi.

As for Billy just throwing a role-claim out there, this can be viewed in two different ways: 1. He's lying and wanting us to believe he's town so we actually kill an innocent. Turns out Billy is mafia. 2. He's telling the truth and wants the fellow townspeople to follow him on his vote toward Koshi.

^ This, I would take into full consideration.

However, I'm going with my gut to say Billy is indeed town. But I don't think Koshi is mafia anymore...

And if there's any reason for Billy to think me and TSL as "good" is what he said himself. That we both tried recruiting eachother and resulted in a fail. But TSL has never given enough for any of us to think otherwise... All we have is me and TSL TRIED MEETING BUT IT FAILED.

And that what I was hiding from everyone was that I was the Mason/Cultist. After, Billy retracted his vote toward me when I supplied enough evidence that indicates I'm not mafia. If you look back, I got the vote on my head 4 times -there's 7 ppl here excluding me since I'm the one in question-. TSL was before the reset. Billy and Slacker after(latter also retracting). As well as Sashe who seems to just be throwing in votes because(to get a faster kill on a good, perhaps? he did this twice; other being Billy). Given the Koshi incident, I ended up voting him out of pure impulse with his asinine claims toward Billy(which made Koshi seem extremely suspicious... but he claims it was due to us pressuring him which for some reason i believe). If we really take into account the possibilities of me being mafia, it seems unlikely. Still possible, but unlikely. And honestly, I don't see why the scum would vote one another. It just doesn't make sense. The only possibility I have being mafia is with Yoshidude. Neither of us voted eachother but Yoshidude did have/still has suspicion of me.

Sashe, your still on my list of possible scummy ppl and not just because your vote is still on me. You exhibit scum-like behavior as Slacker has mentioned.

In conclusion, FoS TSL and FoS Sashe.

You two really stick out.

 

[Yoshidude1]

Ebwop

Sashe and Yoshidude, who out of Billy and Koshi do you suspect more based on all the posts of the day phase?

Eh, it is hard to tell. I think they both have minor Fos. I do have another suspect in Sashe for what I posted above and it is growing the more I think about it.

Well my thoughts about this are me being suspicious of Koshi for not answering some of the questions. Also Billy still after his early mistakes. I still plan on not taking action on any of them right now, but still maybe later. Also where is Slacker?

By the way I will also keep an eye on Sashe for throwing out votes with no proof or evidence earlier on. But, my main focus will be on Koshi and Billy.

 

[H-J Kaabii]

If we go back, a Yoshi preventing a recruitment just seems too low especially considering only 1 night has passed. It would've definitely been by coincidence(as TSL said himself).

And if there's any reason for Billy to think me and TSL as "good" is what he said himself. That we both tried recruiting eachother and resulted in a fail. But TSL has never given enough for any of us to think otherwise... All we have is me and TSL TRIED MEETING BUT IT FAILED.

I just wish to check one thing:

Did we really try recruiting each other and it failed because we're both either the Mason and/or Cultist? While it certainly is very plausible, one does wonder if it failed because TSL is Mafia.

Can you please confirm if you attempted to recruit me in the night phase?

 

[Yoshiman222]

Total Votes :
Billy : 1 (Koshi)
Unknown : 1 (Sashe)
Sashe : 0
Koshi : 1 (Billy)
No Vote? : 1 (Yoshidude)
The discussion was going strong, everyone making assumptions and throwing rumours and information around, votes going on and off. Before everyone started to know it, the sunlight started to fade within the trees. Looking upwards, everyone knew they needed to come to a decision quick. Before anything else was done, however, a Shy Guy went over to the half-full barrel of Mushrooms and kicked it into the river, seeing as how everyone had already taken their mushroom, and it would only cause trouble if they forgot to before it got too dark out...

Basically, everyone has gotten their item for a time now - go nuts with them.
Also - Deadline has been set for a lynch to be made. It's not that I don't like all this discussion, it's just that I wanted to throw you all into a tight spot.
Deadline won't be told since you can't tell how long it'll take until nightfall. Have fun with that.

 

[kinetic563]

If we go back, a Yoshi preventing a recruitment just seems too low especially considering only 1 night has passed. It would've definitely been by coincidence(as TSL said himself).

And if there's any reason for Billy to think me and TSL as "good" is what he said himself. That we both tried recruiting eachother and resulted in a fail. But TSL has never given enough for any of us to think otherwise... All we have is me and TSL TRIED MEETING BUT IT FAILED.

I just wish to check one thing:

Did we really try recruiting each other and it failed because we're both either the Mason and/or Cultist? While it certainly is very plausible, one does wonder if it failed because TSL is Mafia.

Can you please confirm if you attempted to recruit me in the night phase?

Confirming this would be near impossible without ME confirming what role I have. And it's up to the players if they believe me or not.

First, if we take into account what I've previously said about the allegations that were put on my head. The votes/suspicion and the odds against me as being mafia.

Then... Yes... I do confirm to attempting to recruit you during the first night. And my role IS IN FACT the Cultist.

And secondly, as already stated(again), the chances of a Yoshi preventing the recruit is slim. With a total of 8 players(before the medic died obviously) to choose from to prevent, it really shows it was mere coincidence or because it never occurred.

Thirdly, the same can be said for the possibility of whom the Mason might be. Whilst I don't have supporting evidence to back up whether you are it, your direct reply to my suspicion of you throws you off. You wanted me to try my best to make you a 100% mafia with what I have available.

And finally, as you said yourself. Ppl should really take into consideration whether or not your softclaim was a lie. As to maybe avert yourself from ppl blaming you as I was making myself increasingly suspicious.

I feel I've enough on my plate to definitely suspect you as mafia.

And with that, Lynch: TSL.

 

[H-J Kaabii]

Thank you, with this I can safely...

Retract FoS towards Unknown

With this I am certain that what we exchanged in the very first posts of today were indeed the result of a strange coincidence, but one which confirms both our innocences.

I am the Mason and indeed I attempted to recruit Unknown in the first night.

I admit that my words chosen in the soft claim were a bit sketchy, but like I imagine you would have thought, at there were only two possibilities that I could have predicted with reasonable confidence, one being you were mafia, which you aren't. Naturally the other possibility was that you were the cultist and thus couldn't join the masonry.

Admittedly one issue remains, that being whether one or both of us are lying and in fact someone else is a mason or cultist, or even a new recruit (the last of which STILL hasn't been cleared up). If so, I would love to hear the counterclaim that shows where me or Unknown are mistaken.

With this revelation out of the way, and considering nightfall is approaching:

>We can use our recruitment roles as a pseudo means of investigation, since only Shy Guys can be recruited. However, I don't know if there is a White Shy Guy - if there is things can become incredibly dangerous for town if either me or Unknown recruit them and don't realizes the recruit's true allegiance.

>On the same token having two (three if we count Billy) confirmed roles means there's a high chance one of us is going to be sleeping in the Styx by daybreak (if there's no lynch that is). I'm guessing that at least some of you have a Metal Mushroom on you, maybe tonight would be a good time to use it?

>Anyone else with investigation powers such as a Spy Mushroom might consider using it overnight. Maybe such spying results are the sort of definitive evidence you would like seen Koshi?

This hasn't really changed but I still have FoSes at Sashe and Koshi at this moment in time.

 

[kinetic563]

Well... What do we have here.

The only thing as stated that separates us from one of us lying is if someone indeed was recruited.

And all this is very much believeable given the amount of detail. And I assume trust.

I humbly withdraw vote on TSL.

Sashe is up s**tcreak then. Lynch: Sashe.

 

[H-J Kaabii]

After reading through the topic again in its entirety, I'm going to make the following summaries:

Billy made a brilliant deduction earlier in the day:

If I believe HJ's statement at face value though... it implies that both him and Unknown are the Mason/Cultist

And this makes me feel somewhat uneasy with whether he is a Shy Guy like he says. But this is easily resolved with the fall of night. Not to mention he's fatalistic as well... Ugh the read is still murky on him.

Reading Sashe's posts really brings out the minor tells in his framing of the posts. In addition out of everyone his votes are the most unsupported and also quite hasty as well. It certainly pushes me towards voting him...

Continuing from what Slacker has said about his cold mafia read, Sashe initially directed a vote at Billy with limited explanation and then retracted with a sly I'm watching you comment. That doesn't feel like something fellow mafiosos would do.

Yoshidude playing the watch and wait game doesn't help my read on him but there are a few times where there is a suggestion of a connection between him and Sashe, once where Unknown refers to them as fools:

Take whatever I say however you will. I would just be very cautious if I were you.

I'll also leave this here if you don't mind...

I paid a visit to you specifically overnight, yet I was unsuccessful. I feel it to be too coincidental if I was simply blocked by the Yoshis...

See, you avoid answering the question and just blame H-J for being suspicious :-\.

Oh, really? I can assume you and Yoshidude paid no attention to my explanation of that? And if you did why put all the blame on me unless you don't care either way because your Mafia? Is that it? Yours and Yoshidude's statement make both of you look like fools.

And secondly an ebwop to correct an omission which probably doesn't mean much but is still interesting:

Well my thoughts about this are me being suspicious of Koshi for not answering some of the questions. Also Billy still after his early mistakes. I still plan on not taking action on any of them right now, but still maybe later. Also where is Slacker?

By the way I will also keep an eye on Sashe for throwing out votes with no proof or evidence earlier on. But, my main focus will be on Koshi and Billy.

Koshi I feel just had a bad day when he and Billy started countering each other. I'll probably need to see what happens tomorrow.

Slacker hasn't posted with enough frequency to really give anything away yet. I suppose the outcome of Sashe's life or death may shed some light on Slacker's intentions.

I will vote Sashe based on everything I understand at this moment in time. Hopefully he can explain himself before the moon curses us all, or a mafia pushes his wagon to an express date with the Reaper.

 

[Yoshidude1]

I see no reason not to continue my suspicion of Sashe. Vote Sashe.

 

[yoshi1999]

Considering the circumstances I realize Billy probably isn't mafia and I was caught up in the fight with him, which I apologize for. So withdrawing my vote on Billy with all this suspicion on Sashe I have been re-reading their posts and they are very suspicious Vote Sashe